Emily Ladau:
This episode is sponsored by ABLEnow, tax-advantaged savings accounts for eligible individuals with disabilities.
Kyle Khachadurian:
For too long, Americans with Disabilities could not save or invest for the future. Advocates fought hard to change this resulting in the Federal ABLE Act and ABLEnow accounts.
Emily Ladau:
ABLE now accounts help eligible individuals save for the future without endangering eligibility for certain disability benefits such Medicaid and SSI.
Kyle Khachadurian:
ABLEnow is available to qualified individuals in all 50 states. Learn if you or someone you know is eligible for an ABLEnow account@ablenow.com.
Emily Ladau:
Hi, I’m Emily Ladau.
Kyle Khachadurian:
And I’m Kyle Khachadurian.
Emily Ladau:
And you are listening to another episode of The Accessible Stall.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Emily, it’s 2023.
Emily Ladau:
Oh my gosh. I don’t even know what to make of that. You know haven’t actually handwritten the date yet, so I’ve not yet made the mistake. Oh wait. No, I’m lying. I have.
Kyle Khachadurian:
But have you made the mistake?
Emily Ladau:
You know what? I think because I did not make the mistake, it was not momentous. But I did. I had to fill out a withdrawal slip at the bank.
Kyle Khachadurian:
You go into your bank to withdraw money?
Emily Ladau:
Yeah.
Kyle Khachadurian:
You don’t use an ATM?
Emily Ladau:
I mean, I could. But don’t you ever freak out at an ATM? Like someone’s going to come up behind you and be like, “Give me all your money.”
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah, that’s why I don’t use them. That’s why I don’t carry cash.
Emily Ladau:
There’s this two episode arc in the show Dawson’s Creek that has nothing else to do with the rest of the show, really? Except that the main character takes money out of an ATM and a creepy guy follows her in and then mugs her [inaudible 00:01:50].
Kyle Khachadurian:
And that’s why Emily Ladau doesn’t take money out of ATMs.
Emily Ladau:
But then he ends up dying.
Kyle Khachadurian:
What?
Emily Ladau:
Yeah. Plot twist.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Whoa.
Emily Ladau:
So Anyway. Also, spoiler alert, also, I don’t really think anyone’s watching Dawson’s Creek at this exact moment, but…
Kyle Khachadurian:
But if you are, we’re sorry.
Emily Ladau:
Anyway, this is all relevant because we are talking about money today.
Kyle Khachadurian:
What about it, Emily?
Emily Ladau:
It’s really expensive to be disabled.
Kyle Khachadurian:
I am finally… I’m so glad that somebody, meaning us, is saying it finally because it is actually ridiculous.
Emily Ladau:
Yeah. Because we were the first people to ever have this very original thought.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah. I was being very sarcastic in case you couldn’t tell as a listener. I know Emily knew, but just in case you couldn’t. Yeah. This is not original, but we are going to go very in depth.
Emily Ladau:
I think this is really important to talk about, and it does feel kind of apt for the beginning of the year because I know that this is the point in time at which people are making financial goals and career goals and just generally thinking about the future. And disabled people have a harder time doing that.
Kyle Khachadurian:
I don’t even know where to start with this. This is just like a tangled web.
Emily Ladau:
Okay. Why don’t we start with the concept that I think a lot of people tend to talk about, which is the Disability Tax or the Crip Tax, if you want to call it that. Which is to say that when you are disabled, you often have to spend more money because things are not as accessible to you.
So I guess a perfect example for me would be the fact that I live in New York and the subway system is super unfriendly for wheelchair users. And so I will often pay to take a taxi, but that is so much more expensive than taking a subway. And yet sometimes it is the only or the most reliable way for me to get there.
Kyle Khachadurian:
I appreciate that you didn’t use the stereotypical example. When people with disabilities talk about this including… I’m sure we’ve done it before. Where you talk about mobility equipment, like how you use a wheelchair and that costs money. Or how you drive a car and you have to pay for a ramp to be put in it.
Because that’s all true. But I think generally people are starting to maybe get that if you bring that to their attention. But things like the subway being unreliable and you needing a cab exclusively in Manhattan. Things like that that affect your day-to-day life, I don’t think that gets talked about enough, frankly.
Emily Ladau:
Yeah. And it really does add up because the whole discourse about millennials needing to stop it with their avocado toast and their Starbucks.
Kyle Khachadurian:
I really resent that because I neither like avocados nor Starbucks. Still can’t afford.
Emily Ladau:
Well, that affects me for multiple reasons.
Kyle Khachadurian:
So yeah. What? Me, that not liking it or both those things?
Emily Ladau:
I love avocado.
Kyle Khachadurian:
No.
Emily Ladau:
And I don’t love Starbucks really. It’s drinkable.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Ever since… You want to hear this, me being a bougie [inaudible 00:05:20]. Ever since I got my own espresso machine-
Emily Ladau:
I already know what you’re say.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Oh yeah. Mm-hmm.
Emily Ladau:
The people don’t know what you’re going to say. What are you going to say, Kyle?
Kyle Khachadurian:
Ever since I got my espresso machine, I can’t drink Starbucks anymore.
Emily Ladau:
What a princess.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Just 87,000 more lattes before it pays for itself. I’m just kidding, it probably already has by now actually but with how expensive Starbucks is.
Emily Ladau:
Yeah. Having…
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah, it definitely has actually.
Emily Ladau:
… an espresso machine is definitively a way to save money.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah. High upfront cost.
Emily Ladau:
But anyway, the reason that I brought up the whole avocado toast, Starbucks thing is because I feel like that tends to be kind of the accusation. It’s like, “Well, why don’t you have the money saved up? Are you drinking too much Starbucks?”
And it’s like, “No, Starbucks has nothing to do with it. I’m paying 20, $30 for a cab ride just to get from point A to point B.”
Kyle Khachadurian:
To and from. Yeah, and then you got to go back.
Emily Ladau:
Yeah.
Kyle Khachadurian:
That that’s 60 bucks that you could have spent any on anything else and would’ve probably been, not more productive, but personally more enjoyable.
Emily Ladau:
And I should clarify that I definitely do use buses whenever possible and the subway if I can, although at my own risk. But sometimes a cab really is my only option. And on top of that, if we want to talk about it from the perspective of time is money, it takes freaking forever to get a cab sometimes.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Well, time is money. And that’s why…. That’s the other thing. You know what? If you’re late to a gig because you couldn’t find reliable transportation on a bus that was 30 minutes late. Or something like that.
Emily Ladau:
I mean, this is me all the time. Like there were-
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah, I know. You are hyper early for things for that reason, I know that. Yeah.
Emily Ladau:
There was one time… Okay, I’m early to gigs and events and the airport but if I’m just hanging out with friends, I’m definitely not running on time.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Oh yeah, no. You’re professionally early.
Emily Ladau:
Yeah. That’s a great way to describe me.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah, I just made that up, you can have that one for free. And so can everyone else hearing this.
Emily Ladau:
Oh man, I just forgot what I was going to say. Make another point while I try to bring my [inaudible 00:07:47].
Kyle Khachadurian:
No, I was just going to say especially for what you do, your time actually is money. That’s not just you being cliché and saying a saying. So… Oh, did I make your-
Emily Ladau:
You reminded me.
Kyle Khachadurian:
All right. Let’s go, let’s hear it.
Emily Ladau:
No, what you were saying reminded me. So it’s also when I travel for work, whereas other people have a lot more options at their disposal, I very often have to schedule fairly expensive accessible transportation. And it’s often a medical transport company.
Kyle Khachadurian:
That’s right.,I remember that. Well, I only had to do it with you a handful of times, but that’s something that I didn’t know. And this is a world that I’m also in. It’s just interesting.
Emily Ladau:
Well, but it’s not your physical experience.
Kyle Khachadurian:
That’s true. That is true.
Emily Ladau:
But I mean, I don’t want to get too hung up on the transportation aspect of it, but that’s really where it affects me. Although I will also say, and this is something I think people don’t realize, you also end up spending more money on where you live because you need to find an accessible location or you need to adapt the location that you’re in. I think I can finally-
Kyle Khachadurian:
Both of those things cost money.
Emily Ladau:
Right. I think I can reveal, I am getting an apartment in Manhattan, and… Insert party blower horn noise here.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Thank you. Future me…
Emily Ladau:
Woo woo.
Kyle Khachadurian:
… and this me thanks you for that.
Emily Ladau:
But the point that I want to make here is I could have found any old apartment in any old borough in Brooklyn, any old borough like Brooklyn.
Kyle Khachadurian:
You are such a bad New Yorker. No, no. But it’s true, you could have saved a ton of money.
Emily Ladau:
Exactly.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Like a ton of it.
Emily Ladau:
But then I would not have been near an accessible subway stop and I would not have been able to pee because the bathrooms in cheaper New York City apartments are all the size of shoe boxes.
Kyle Khachadurian:
For those of you who have not been to New York City and are not from New York City, Emily is not exaggerating. You barely have enough room to turn yourself.
Emily Ladau:
Right. I would like to be able to freely do the hokey pokey in my bathroom.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah.
Emily Ladau:
That’s what it’s all about. All right, all right. I’ll see myself out.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Aye.
Emily Ladau:
I will see myself out. I just want to say that I recognize there is… And everybody… I feel like people laugh at us when we say this at this point, but it needs to be said, “Yes, there is a degree of privilege in this conversation.”
Kyle Khachadurian:
That doesn’t affect… The issue still persists.
Emily Ladau:
Yeah. Just being a disabled person means so many of the basic financial things that people take for granted, we can’t, because we’re constantly balancing our finances against systems that are flawed and designed to supposedly support us while actually keeping disabled people in poverty.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah. I don’t really have an analogy for transportation because I have the privilege of being ambulatory, at least for now. But I think one of my things if I could draw an analogy would be like… I’m a chronic saver. Now, I’m that way because my family is that way. But I was telling you this off camera and we were deciding to do this episode.
If I lost my job tomorrow, I can’t do air quotes, no skill. Which by the way, I hate that term, every job requires skill. That’s why it’s work. But jobs that people tend to think that anyone can “just get,” I can’t do any of those. And so I’m a chronic saver. One, just in case. But two, because my body hurts now. It’s not bad, no one should feel bad for me, but 30 more years of this, it’s going to be rough.
So I try to make sure that I don’t have to do that. And saying that is privilege too, but I don’t really have much of a choice. It’s a rat race against myself.
Emily Ladau:
If you win the rat race, you’re still a rat.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah, that’s right.
Emily Ladau:
Anyway.
Kyle Khachadurian:
I like that, I like that. No, but I think if you’re disabled listening to this, I think you understand what we’re saying. I do.
Emily Ladau:
Yeah. I think that a really crucial point to make here is the fact that a lot of people have first jobs that are being a waitress.
Kyle Khachadurian:
On your feet.
Emily Ladau:
Or standing on your feet all day. Or why… I guess because I’ve never worked any of these jobs. Help, what other jobs require you to be on your feet all day?
Kyle Khachadurian:
A cashier.
Emily Ladau:
Right. Like check out at the grocery store.
Kyle Khachadurian:
A sales associate, like a floor guy.
Emily Ladau:
Shelf stacking.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah. Oh, shelf stacking is a good one because you’re in the back and I can’t lift 50 pounds. I mean, I can but then I can’t walk with it.
Emily Ladau:
Right, exactly. So when I think about jobs like this, there’s sort of this expectation, and every once in a while I see the discourse going around on social media. Every teenager should have to work in a restaurant or every teenager should have to stock shelves because it’s good for their work ethic and it teaches you how to be a better employee.
And it’s like, I can’t do that. You do not want me carrying your hot bowl of soup.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Also, I take a little bit offense to that because I think I’m a pretty good employee. I don’t think… I do understand the sentiment behind those things but I ultimately think that that’s just the quote unquote older generation trying to stick it to people who are younger than them just because we have just a way different outlook on the way we view work as a generation than they do.
Emily Ladau:
There’s also a flip side to this though that I think is really important to acknowledge as well, which is that the same people who are all like, “Oh, you need to work in a restaurant or you need to stock shelves,” are the same people who look down on…
Kyle Khachadurian:
Oh my God.
Emily Ladau:
… disabled people who do get jobs like that, who are a greeter at Walmart, who do work helping bad groceries. And it’s like, “You can’t have it both ways.”
Kyle Khachadurian:
Exactly. Yeah, just list the kind of jobs that you think are beneath you. It makes it all easier.
Emily Ladau:
You are being an ableist jerk either way. There is nothing that is not respectable about those jobs. It is a perfectly respectable job to help bag groceries, it’s a perfectly respectable job to be a greeter at Walmart. Because you know what? I’m not really great at bagging my own groceries. I need that help.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Neither am I. And you know what? I’m a little… not upset, but I find it sort of cosmically funny that you even have to say that given the fact that over the past two years, society in this country has supposedly learned what essential workers are. And yet, I think it’s safe to say that most of us haven’t learned a thing.
Emily Ladau:
Yeah, no. People still look down on people who are doing the essential work of… Let’s say, domestic jobs as well.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yep.
Emily Ladau:
House cleaning or laundry services or food delivery.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Or a DSP.
Emily Ladau:
A direct service provider.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yep.
Emily Ladau:
Yes.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah.
Emily Ladau:
All things that I really can’t do. Although I guess I would just say I actually have been a DSP before but it was more from an academic support standpoint, not like a physical support standpoint.
Kyle Khachadurian:
No. But these are things that, for better or worse, like it or not, you or I might need in the future. These are things… And they need to be paid. And it’s just things that you think about. Not every day, but it’s just like people who don’t have disabilities never have to think about that.
They might have to think about it for their family if they’re getting older, but we have to think about it early. That’s a burden that not a lot of people have. And frankly no one needs.
Emily Ladau:
Yeah. And we have to be strategic about saving because God forbid something happens. I mean, long-term supports and services are expensive for everyone, but especially for disabled people, there can be broader implications there that will make it more expensive.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Emily Ladau:
So I just think that it’s really essential to talk about the impacts of disability on finances, but also to understand that there are people who are actively working towards solutions.
So even though the government is still like, “We’re going to legislate your button into poverty,” there are people who have fought for legislation to change that. And I actually think this is probably a good moment to be like today’s episode, the most sponsored by…
Kyle Khachadurian:
The most perfect segue way I’ve ever heard. This episode is sponsored by ABLEnow. Tax advantage savings accounts for eligible individuals with disabilities.
Emily Ladau:
For too long, Americans with disabilities could not save or invest for the future. Advocates fought hard to change this resulting in a grassroots movement that changed the law so people with disabilities can achieve a better life experience.
Kyle Khachadurian:
ABLEnow accounts help eligible individuals save for the future without endangering certain disability benefits that are critical for health and independence.
Emily Ladau:
There’s no enrollment fee, no minimum amount required to start your savings and anyone can contribute.
Kyle Khachadurian:
ABLEnow accounts are specifically designed for people with disabilities and are available to qualified individuals in all 50 states.
Emily Ladau:
Funds in your ABLEnow account can pay for a variety of qualified disability expenses related to health, independence and quality of life.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Make 2023 the year you get your finances in order learn if you or someone is eligible to open an ABLEnow at ablenow.com.
Emily Ladau:
I’m really glad that there are solutions out there like ABLEnow because disabled people have as much of a right to save for future as anybody else.
At the same time, I hope ABLEnow will not take offense to me saying that it bums me out that stuff that has to exist. That doesn’t mean I’m not thrilled that it does exist. I just wish that systemically things were different.
Kyle Khachadurian:
I think they’ll understand. Also, they’re not paying us to say this part but I just felt the need to bring it up. But even their debit card is accessible. It’s got a little divot in it that makes it easy for you-
Emily Ladau:
Oh, he’s been waiting to say this.
Kyle Khachadurian:
… to pull it out of the wallet. I know. Yeah, I’ve been waiting to say this since like [inaudible 00:19:22].
Emily Ladau:
Wait, sorry. I talked over you. Say it again.
Kyle Khachadurian:
No. I just wanted to say, we are not getting paid to say this part, this is strictly personal opinion, but it’s good opinion. Their debit card is accessible. It’s got a little notch in it so that when you pull it out of your wallet, it’s easier to grip and you can distinguish it from your other cards.
Emily Ladau:
Can I tell you how much I wish that was a feature of all cards? Because-
Kyle Khachadurian:
Me.. Same.
Emily Ladau:
I don’t have good dexterity.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah, no. Even if you did, it’s kind of hard to pinch and pull out of a wallet whose pockets are the exact size of your credit cards. I mean, it’s not going to be easy to get in and out. So [inaudible 00:20:04] able now. Seriously. It’s really good.
Emily Ladau:
Have we talked lately about how vaccine cards don’t fit in your wallet? Not that people ask for them anymore,.
Kyle Khachadurian:
No. But I hate that, actually. How did we screw that up?
Emily Ladau:
Makes me so mad.
Kyle Khachadurian:
How did we actually screw that one up? I mean, I have it on my phone now.
Emily Ladau:
Oh yeah. There’s like some pass that you can keep on your phone. Anyway, back to disability being expensive.
Kyle Khachadurian:
It is. We have to pay for grocery delivery. You know why? Because we can’t… I mean we can, but it’ll tire us out for the rest of the day. And I don’t bringing up the spoon theory because I think it ultimately is a good start to an analogy, but I think the essay that everyone knows is flawed. It’s not the fault of the author. I think the people ran with it and didn’t realize it was just a way to explain energy.
I think it’s a brilliant essay, but the way that it affects me in my day-to-day life is if I have to do something like grocery shopping, that takes a lot out of me. Not physically, but mentally. And also I break my eggs and then I waste eggs. So I don’t like that. So I have to pay extra for grocery deliver.
Emily Ladau:
And inflation is a real thing and eggs are becoming increasingly expensive so we can’t break our eggs.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Have you bought eggs? Have you bought eggs lately? It is… Oh boy, they are… I’m just going to say people who own chickens right now, who we’ve been laughing at for years are finally having their time.
Emily Ladau:
I have family members who own chickens. I have family friends who have chickens. Yeah, I mean I don’t [inaudible 00:21:46] want chickens.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Let me get their contact phone real quick, I need to important some eggs. But the point being is like, yeah, food’s expensive. And breaking an egg, it used to be like, “Oh no.” And now especially, it’s like, “Oh, now I don’t have breakfast.”
Emily Ladau:
Oh my God, Kyle.
Kyle Khachadurian:
What’s that?
Emily Ladau:
This is our moment to go full circle back to episode one where we talk about the fact that sometimes we need to buy pre-packaged food because it’s easier, but it’s more expensive.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Emily, you are a genius. This is for the people who-
Emily Ladau:
Sorry, we’re just like having a moment of silence.
Kyle Khachadurian:
We don’t release video with this podcast, but I just want you to know that my face, as soon as she started talking, I knew exactly where she was going and I couldn’t believe my ears. My face lit up, because she is incredibly correct.
Emily Ladau:
That was a revelation. Anyway, in case you haven’t listened to our very first episode ever, or you just need a refresher, we were inspired to talk about the fact that people were arguing over pre-peeled oranges and saying it was bad for me environment and totally wasteful, but disabled people were like, “Hey, I can’t peel my orange. This is actually great for me.”
But yes, it’s great. It’s also more expensive. I love buying things that are pre-chopped, pre-packaged, and especially because I’m going to be living on my own now in many ways. Yeah, I’m going to want that pre-chopped stuff. They sell these little packages of apples that are precut and I have a hard time eating full apples. I also am not super great with my knife skills.
Kyle Khachadurian:
I like to cut my own apples. However, I will say I’ve recently transitioned from an apple cutter to a knife because apple cutters, I don’t know if you’ve ever seen one before. But they are-
Emily Ladau:
Are you talking about the circular core thing that you push down on?
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yes. It’s like a death machine actually if you touch it the wrong way. So I’m just like, “I’ll learn how to cut an apple.” So I did, but I fully respect that I buy pre-sliced mushrooms. Not that I don’t enjoy slicing mushrooms, but the pre-sliced ones are a 3 cent difference. And it saves me time.
Emily Ladau:
To be fair, I totally can chop apples. I was actually just last month like an apple chopping machine because we were making apple sauce for our latkes for Hanukkah. So yes, I’m capable of cutting an apple, but-
Kyle Khachadurian:
I’m going to need your latke recipe by the way. Sorry I didn’t interrupt you.
Emily Ladau:
Oh, hell yeah.
Kyle Khachadurian:
I just need it because I didn’t need to make some for myself.
Emily Ladau:
Okay. That’s important, I can share that.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Thank you.
Emily Ladau:
Anyway, we digress. But I think the thing is that I’m not great at peeling oranges. I have a really hard time, let’s say even like, I don’t know, handling a heavy pot of water mean. So there are a lot of things that are kitchen hacks for me that I know are going to make my life easier and are also going to make my life more expensive.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Even though everybody needs to eat, the fact that you’re bringing up these… I feel like able people tend to maybe I’m assuming, but if we’re going off of what the pre-peeled orange debate was, like they’re gimmicks. And yeah, maybe for another able person they’re gimmicks but for us it’s a time save or it’s a way to do something that we couldn’t do before.
And yes, that’s just food but you can apply that to every single aspect of everything that a disabled person does. And that includes money, by the way. That includes money. I can’t think of an exact one-to-one analogy, but there have been times where I forego something because I’m like, “Okay, but if I save up a couple bucks I can buy this expensive thing that can help me out doing something that is annoying to do.”
I’ve done that a bunch in my life, buying something more expensive and reliable.
Emily Ladau:
Well, I actually have an example.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Oh yeah?
Emily Ladau:
Yeah. And it wasn’t even so much me saving money as me just being stubborn.
Kyle Khachadurian:
That’s the best way to save money. It is, it’s how I do it.
Emily Ladau:
So I was traveling quite a bit pre-COVID, and I think that I just had some kind of a mental block because there were plenty of things that I could have purchased to make my travels easier and I just wouldn’t do it. And as of late, travel has picked back up a little bit again.
Obviously with me wearing a mask when I’m traveling, I need to say that, COVID is not over. But when I was in hotel rooms, I would have so much trouble with outlet cords and plugs and reaching things. And there was always only two outlets by the bed, but I needed three.
Kyle Khachadurian:
What is that?
Emily Ladau:
I don’t understand, it’s so frustrating. But it would be like, I need to charge my wheelchair. I use a CPP and I need to plug that in. I need to plug my phone in next to me. And I never had enough outlets.
And finally, finally, after years of having this issue, I went on Amazon and for 15 bucks found myself an extension cord thing that had three outlets that I could plug in so that I can make things easier for myself.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Oh, it had one male end and three female ends?
Emily Ladau:
Yes.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Or an amount of them?
Emily Ladau:
Yeah. So like-
Kyle Khachadurian:
That’s cool, that’s really cool.
Emily Ladau:
I can plug into one outlet. And then it’s [inaudible 00:27:52] like an outlet splitter kind of thing.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Nice. Oh, I got to get me one of those.
Emily Ladau:
It’s so great. And it’s great quality and it was not expensive and I use it all the time. And I need it, it’s a disability related thing because I need to plug in the thing that allows me to breathe at night. And my wheelchair-
Kyle Khachadurian:
And the thing that… and your legs.
Emily Ladau:
… which allows me to move during the day.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah.
Emily Ladau:
Just charging my legs and my lungs here, no big deal.
Kyle Khachadurian:
That’s funny. That’s funny.
Emily Ladau:
But I refused for the longest time because I was like, “It’s not fair that I should have to spend money on something just so that I can plug stuff in.” And finally I was like, “Fine. I’m going to spend 15 bucks.” And it’s been life changing.
Kyle Khachadurian:
I’m curious if I can think of something like that for me, but I don’t think I can at the moment. But I’m sure I’ve done it, I am sure that I’ve done it. And I’m also sure that you’ve probably been the one to convince me to do it at certain points.
Emily Ladau:
Oh yeah. I feel like sometimes you just need to take-
Kyle Khachadurian:
I have-
Emily Ladau:
Go ahead.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Oh, go ahead. Oh, okay. I was just going to say, I have a very hard time justifying things to myself that I know good and well that will make my life easier. Other people is easy.
Emily Ladau:
Oh yeah.
Kyle Khachadurian:
But if it’s me… Oh, and especially if it’s a disability thing. Like I’m not ashamed of it at all, but there’s still this part of me where it’s like, “Well, you could do it that way and it would be easier or you could save $10 and do it the hard way.”
Emily Ladau:
That’s always me.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah, but I always pick that option. It’s like, what’s wrong with me? It’s like, come on.
Emily Ladau:
Well, it’s I think because we grew up with the mentality like, “No, you can’t just spend willy-nilly.”
Kyle Khachadurian:
You also, huh? You too?
Emily Ladau:
Yeah, absolutely. You don’t just have oodles and oodles of money to spend on things that are completely frivolous. So I get that mindset.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah. I-
Emily Ladau:
But also access is not frivolous.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Exactly. Most purchases that I make, even if it’s things that I enjoy, I have to justify improving my life somehow. And I don’t know if I would be that way if I wasn’t disabled. Probably. Maybe, a little bit. But I guarantee you that being disabled has made me more this way.
My doctor was like, “You should take vitamin D3 in the winter.” Back when I was in Seattle. Because in the winter in Seattle, daylight lasts for about 45 minutes between 5:30 AM and 6:00 AM or 6:15 AM. But I just couldn’t spend the eight bucks on vitamin D, which is something ridiculous because it will just drastically improve your mental health. But I didn’t do it. Because, reasons.
Emily Ladau:
You should do it.
Kyle Khachadurian:
No, I did do it. This is… I’ve been and done it.
Emily Ladau:
Although interestingly enough, I have to take vitamin D not so much for seasonal effective disorder, but more so because I have really weak bones. And so I get injections twice a year to strengthen my bones. And part of the thing when you take those injections is you need to take calcium supplements and vitamin D supplements every single day.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Drink your milk, Emily.
Emily Ladau:
I don’t even like… No, I drink almond milk.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Milk is disgusting.
Emily Ladau:
I don’t mind milk.
Kyle Khachadurian:
No, me neither. But it’s gross wen you think about what it is.
Emily Ladau:
When you think about it, yeah. Yeah. So I am required to take those supplements. So that’s an added expense.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Here’s one that my partner probably won’t appreciate if I tell them to tell anyway. A while ago, she drops her keys down the elevator shift and… We didn’t live together at the time. And I was like, “Don’t you have one of those things that retract your keys to your body so you don’t lose your keys.”
And she was like, “No. If I had one of those, I wouldn’t have done what happened. It wouldn’t have happened.” So I got her one, and she still uses it. But it’s that kind of thing where if it’s for someone else, I can do that. If it’s for me, it’s impossible. It’s impossible.
Emily Ladau:
That’s an excellent idea, actually. Because when I-
Kyle Khachadurian:
Oh yeah, would recommend.
Emily Ladau:
… drop something, I can’t pick it up by myself.
Kyle Khachadurian:
It’s a little tether that is attached to a carabiner, or carabiner, I don’t how to say that word. It’s a word I’ve only ever seen in
Emily Ladau:
I think it’s carabiner.
Kyle Khachadurian:
There you go.
Emily Ladau:
Carabiner. Sorry, I love you.
Kyle Khachadurian:
It’s one of those words…. No, no, it’s fine. But what’s a… Everyone’s got a word like that.
Emily Ladau:
Oh yeah. The first time I read the word chaos out loud, I said, chows..
Kyle Khachadurian:
Chows. Yeah.
Emily Ladau:
And the first time I saw the word pho, I was like, [inaudible 00:33:10].
Kyle Khachadurian:
Oh, true. Yeah.
Emily Ladau:
Anyway.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah, no, it attaches to your backpack and it’s like an eight- foot lead. So you put your keys on it and if you drop it, they don’t go anywhere.
Emily Ladau:
Brilliant.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Would recommend. Yeah. Do you want one?
Emily Ladau:
I’ll go on Amazon.
Kyle Khachadurian:
And that’s the… We talked about Amazon briefly on a previous episode, but I just want to bring up that too, because Amazon, although they sell everything, the thing that they sell most to people like Emily, and I don’t mean to speak for you here, is convenience and time saving. That’s what Amazon really sells to people like us. No? Because I was like-
Emily Ladau:
You can absolutely speak for me here because I feel the same way.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah, a toothbrush might be two bucks cheaper down the street, but then Emily won’t have to get in her wheelchair, get out the door, deal with the uneven curb, find the curb cut wait for someone to open the door because the door’s heavy. All that.
Emily Ladau:
You really forgot to mention putting my bra on because that’s-
Kyle Khachadurian:
Oh, I’m sorry.
Emily Ladau:
… like the first deal breaker.
Kyle Khachadurian:
I assumed that you were dressed at the beginning of this, how silly of me. No, she’s right.
Emily Ladau:
Literally earlier today my dad was like, “By the way, you need to put clothes on before you open the door.” I was like, “Wow. Thanks for this great adulting life advice. I really appreciate it.” No, but even getting dressed is complicated. I don’t mean to be a little complainer here but…
Kyle Khachadurian:
You have a sock putter onner. Now ultimately, that’s not an inexpensive piece of equipment but it is something that you need that someone else. And that’s a financial thing no matter how small.
Emily Ladau:
100%.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Also, I love bring up your sock putter onner.
Emily Ladau:
I love my sock putter onner, but it’s a necessary tool. And getting dressed is challenging, and leaving the house is challenging. And I know I’m being a big baby right now, but sometimes it’s just easier to get things delivered. I’m really sorry that everyone hates Jeff Bezos, but Amazon does a service.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Hey, me too. I’m not… But he does sell convenience. Even… and I’m not simping for Amazon right now, but even the frustration free packaging where all you have to do is tear it like how you used to open a CD. Remember those?
Emily Ladau:
Yep. So accessible to me.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah, it’s great. And we’ve said this in a previous episode, there’s obviously something to be said about Amazon doing what it does and being who they are. But when you’re disabled, you have to take all of the necessary… I don’t even want to call them shortcuts. They’re shortcuts to you. But for us, they’re just alternate routes to possibility.
Emily Ladau:
It makes me think of, and hopefully this is not too niche a reference, but in The Good Place, how everything is sort of balanced on an ethical scale.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yes.
Emily Ladau:
You bought flowers for your mom, but the flowers are killing the environment when you cut them from the bush.
Kyle Khachadurian:
There’s this chicken sandwich that’s delicious, but if you eat it means you hate gay people. That’s the line I remember.
Emily Ladau:
Oh, the Chick-fil-A reference?
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah. I mean that’s what they were talking about.
Emily Ladau:
Yeah, yeah.
Kyle Khachadurian:
But the whole show is that. If you haven’t seen it, you should. You should watch it, it’s a good…
Emily Ladau:
Excellent show. But I feel like that all the time. I feel like I’m constantly going up and down the ethical ladder, because on the one hand, I know that Amazon is this incredibly flawed corporation and on the other hand it’s like, “Yes, but I need that”
Kyle Khachadurian:
And it’s not, “But I want that,” which is I think a very important distinction. I mean, it very often is, but not what we’re talking about right now. It’s, “I need that.”
Emily Ladau:
Yeah, it’s not really a matter of want. It’s usually just like, “Well, it’s a lot easier for me to get this thing delivered to my front door mail room, what have you.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Do you have a mail room?
Emily Ladau:
I do.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Nice.
Emily Ladau:
And can I just tell you something?
Kyle Khachadurian:
You can tell me anything.
Emily Ladau:
The way that it’s laid out, it’s like four mailboxes stacked on top of each other and they’re all in a row and they’re all low down. They’re all on a table.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Oh, nice.
Emily Ladau:
And my apartment number is the bottom.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Did you do that on purpose or is it just happened like that?
Emily Ladau:
No, it was intentionally designed that way because it’s an accessible apartment. Quote, air quote, “Accessible.” But I can reach my mailbox.
Kyle Khachadurian:
I bet it’s a lot more accessible than the people next to you, their apartment.
Emily Ladau:
Want to know something funny? The apartment next to me was vacant, so I checked that out too. And yeah, it is more accessible. We just checked it out for a frame of reference, and I couldn’t even so much as get in the bathroom.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Well, that’s kind of… I mean unfortunately you couldn’t get a bathroom. But isn’t that kind of nice to know that they’re not BSing you. Like they actually-
Emily Ladau:
Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. But anyway, I’m sure that there will be a lot more episodes with Adventures in Apartment Living with Emily and Kyle.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Oh yeah. It’s going down now.
Emily Ladau:
For now-
Kyle Khachadurian:
I can’t wait.
Emily Ladau:
I feel like we should probably do our final takeaways.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah. Being disabled is expensive. And even though every disabled person listening to this knows that, it is so much more than, “Oh, my wheelchair costs 20 grand. Oh, my accessible van costs 50 grand.” It is those things.
Emily Ladau:
Can I say something? Those were low estimates on both…
Kyle Khachadurian:
Really?
Emily Ladau:
… scores. Oh yeah.
Kyle Khachadurian:
See, I don’t know what I’m talking about. And it’s also more than disabled people living in forced poverty because that’s also true. But it’s a privilege to say this, we don’t, and yet our cost of living is higher than yours, non-disabled listener because we are born this way. In ways that hopefully over the past 40 minutes we’ve convinced you.
Emily Ladau:
Although we shouldn’t have to convince anyone, people should just…
Kyle Khachadurian:
I completely agree.
Emily Ladau:
… understand this frustrating reality. Although I think I just want to clarify one thing before I give my final takeaway, which is obviously I understand that if you are a non-disabled person who is a caregiver for a disabled person, then you definitely also get that it’s more expensive.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Oh yeah, you know. We’re not talking to you, but I’m glad you said that. That reminds me of the Superstore episode. You remember when they had that pizza party for all the people of color and then the disabled white person goes up to Garrett and she goes, “Can I go in?” And he’s like, “Oh yeah, you’re good. Go ahead.”
Emily Ladau:
Oh my God, I know her.
Kyle Khachadurian:
No way. You know her?
Emily Ladau:
Yeah. The actress, the wheelchair user?
Kyle Khachadurian:
Dude, that’s so cool. I love her. I love her, she’s great.
Emily Ladau:
Yeah, I know her. She’s great.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Cool.
Emily Ladau:
Name is Nicole Evans. She’s really cool.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Nice.
Emily Ladau:
Anyway, that was a flex. Anyway, I’m going to stop now. My key takeaway is I think it is really frustrating that disabled people have to pay more for basic things. However, I also think that it is really important to reemphasize that there are resources out there to make that more navigable.
And ABLEnow is one of those resources. And I think that it’s so crucial that we have these conversations and we share these resources. Because I feel like for disabled people, so much of how we understand how to get by is word of mouth and connecting with other disabled people.
Kyle Khachadurian:
I will also say that they’re not paying me to say this, but we use it in our household and nothing but good things to say. Truly.
Emily Ladau:
Yeah. I mean, we love that they’re advertising with us but we also never, ever, ever would promote something that we didn’t believe in.
Kyle Khachadurian:
What’s your final takeaway? Or did you just say it? Did I-
Emily Ladau:
I think I was trying to make my final takeaway what I said before about… What the heck did I just say? I don’t know. I’m sure it was interesting.
Kyle Khachadurian:
It was good, it was good.
Emily Ladau:
I don’t remember. Great.
Kyle Khachadurian:
All right. Well that was our first episode of 2023. We will be making more, that is a… Yeah, we’re, we’re both the same side of-
Emily Ladau:
That’s a promise.
Kyle Khachadurian:
It is. We’re both on the same side of the country, so we’ll [inaudible 00:41:47] more.
Emily Ladau:
We’re in the same time zone.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Isn’t it great? We don’t have to record while I eat dinner and you need to go to sleep.
Emily Ladau:
So good.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Now we can just record when we both need to go to sleep. That is actually way better.
Emily Ladau:
Right. That’s right. Although I ate a really disappointing dinner today and yesterday.
Kyle Khachadurian:
I’m so sorry.
Emily Ladau:
I’m like so overdue on disappointing dinners.
Kyle Khachadurian:
I had a HelloFresh meal today, it was really good.
Emily Ladau:
Ooh, which one?
Kyle Khachadurian:
They call it chicken penne a limone and it’s like calm down, it’s lemon penne with chicken. It’s delicious.
Emily Ladau:
Oh, I know what you’re talking about though. Wait, hold on. Oh my God. I just need to say this last thing. HelloFresh is a perfect example.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Oh my God, what am I… Oh my God, this is so on brand for us. Yes. My partner and I use HelloFresh literally every week. And it’s cheaper than going to the grocery store. Not by much, but it is, and it’s solely because we’re disabled and it takes the mental stress and physical stress out of planning meals. Thank you for coming to my TED Talk.
Emily Ladau:
And less prep time, right?
Kyle Khachadurian:
They’re not paying me for that either. And less what?
Emily Ladau:
Less prep time.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Oh my God, yeah. Way less, way less.
Emily Ladau:
Great.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Because you don’t have to think about the food. It’s there and it’s all proportioned. This is not an ad for HelloFresh, I just really like them.
Emily Ladau:
Why do we always think of something like very major right at the end of an episode?
Kyle Khachadurian:
I don’t know. If I were being my digital marketer self, I would say, “Oh, it’s on purpose to provide reason for retention.” But it’s not, you just forget.
Emily Ladau:
Totally not. Although you want to hear a cool stat. So our podcast player measures what’s known as impactful plays, which is how many people have listened to more than 75% of the episode. And our stat is consistently at about 85%. Which means that most people listen all the way through to our episode.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yo, that’s excellent.
Emily Ladau:
So I’d to think that people hear our ridiculous end of episode revelations.
Kyle Khachadurian:
That’s so great. Thank you all. We really appreciate all of you, truly.
Emily Ladau:
Did we even say Happy New Year? Sorry about that.
Kyle Khachadurian:
I think we said it at the end of our last episode, but if we didn’t, Happy New Year. It’s still January when we record this. And we hope you have a wonderful 2023 and had a wonderful winter holiday of your choice.
Emily Ladau:
And if it is in your budget this year to support The Accessible Stall, because you know what else is expensive? Transcription.
Kyle Khachadurian:
And you can do that. You can help us make every current and future episode of The Accessible Stall accessible by going to patreon.com/theaccessiblestall. Even just $1 a month ensures that all current and future episodes of the accessible Soul remain what?
Emily Ladau:
Accessible. Woo.
Kyle Khachadurian:
See, it’s practically a cheer at this point.
Emily Ladau:
Give me an A, give a B. I’ll stop. I’m going to stop.
Kyle Khachadurian:
B, C. Accessible.
Emily Ladau:
[inaudible 00:44:58] going.
Kyle Khachadurian:
No, it’s a long word.
Emily Ladau:
Be accessible. Be, be accessible.
Kyle Khachadurian:
We can’t do that because then you’ll learn about me that I do not know how to spell that word. So.
Emily Ladau:
Accessible. A-C-C-E-S-S-I-B-L-E.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Oh, okay. I do know how to spell it, because I was doing it. Okay.
Emily Ladau:
Mississippi. M-I-S-S-I-S-S-I-P-P-I.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Can you tell Emily’s lifelong dream was to win the spelling bee?
Emily Ladau:
Oh my God. Okay, last thing before we go. So in fifth grade I was in a spelling bee.
Kyle Khachadurian:
My God, I was kidding. Oh my God. I love this story already. Okay, cool.
Emily Ladau:
In fifth grade, I was in a spelling bee. My mom came to watch, it was the entire fifth grade class. The teacher gave me the word. It was yeast, like the kind that you put in bread, yeast. So what did I say? “Yeast. W-E-A-S-T.” And the teacher looks at me and goes, “You sure about that?”
And I was like, “W-E-A-S-T.” And he was like, “The word was yeast, not weast.” And I was disqualified. And my mother probably almost disowned me that day. It was the worst day of my entire life.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah. Unfortunate core memory that must be.
Emily Ladau:
Mm-hmm, it was really formative. That’s why I’m therapy now actually.
Kyle Khachadurian:
It explains so much. Oh god, that’s amazing. I think it’s my favorite thing you’ve ever told me.
Emily Ladau:
And on that note.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Might we say, you look great today.
Emily Ladau:
So good. Happy 2023, y’all. Stay tuned, we’ve got a lot of good episodes coming up. And-
Kyle Khachadurian:
Yeah, we actually do. We’re so excited.
Emily Ladau:
Heck yeah. We love you. We appreciate you.
Kyle Khachadurian:
Good night, everybody.
Emily Ladau:
Bye. Thanks for listening.