E: Hi, I’m Emily Ladau
K: And I’m Kyle Khachadurian
E: And you’re listening to another episode of The Accessible Stall, whoooo!
K: Hooray! What are we gonna talk about today, Emily?
E: Wait, hold on, except not really because literally seconds before we recorded this episode, Kyle decided to break my heart and point out that there was one episode that we called a Bonus Episode. So this is actually episode fifty-one. But in terms of numbered episodes, this is fifty.
So, whoooo! (laughs)
K: This is fifty.
E: Regardless, we’ve now been podcasting for quite awhile.
K: For two years! Two years!
E: Yeah, just about. It’s almost our Podcast-versary!
K: I mean really, think about it, our voices have been flowing through the airwaves into people’s ears every two weeks for two years! That’s wild!
E: I actually just feel sorry for those people for having to listen to us (chuckles)
K: Oh man, yeah.
E: We should get voice modifiers.
K: Yeah I’ll make mine all deep and sultry. And you can make yours really nasally. E: So, just like now?
K: They’ll never know.
E: (laughs) But yeah here we are. We’ve made it through fifty episodes. Fifty one. God, I’m so angry.
K: Fifty. It’s fifty.
E: But also, in terms of putting it out, yes. But in terms of the sheer number of episodes we’ve recorded that have never seen the light of day…
K: Oh God, um this is actually in terms of like recording session, number like, fifty-eight. E: No, I would venture to say more like sixty-five.
K: It’s not.
E: I think it is though.
K: No, I’m telling you, I have a list, it’s actually not.
E: Can you stop bursting my bubble every five seconds please?
K: I wasn’t trying to be a jerk, it’s just one of the things I know,
E: You’re a huge jerk, Kyle.
K: I work on the show you know?
E: Yeah, I mean that’s one thing that I feel like deserves some acknowledgement right up front. I don’t think people know, Kyle’s the brawn behind this show. I’m the brains
K: Yeah…But it’s like an even split. It’s not to say that you do less work and I do more work or I do less work and you do more work, you know? It’s not the case.
E: Kyle is our editing, and backend and website guru.
K: Not to mention, I’ll occasionally transcribe an episode. E: When was the last time you even did that?
K: I didn’t have a job. So that long ago.
E: That was a while ago. So now we have some really nice people who have been pitching in to do it for us. And we do pay them.
K: Thank you guys! You know what’s weird? You say that I’m the brawn but you’re the whole reason why we have a listener base. So you might call that the brain but it’s so much more than that, you gotta give yourself more credit cause it’s legit man.
E: Are you saying that we’re both equally brains and brawn? K: Yes. Definitely.
E: I’m 100% sure that people just come to hear your voice. K: (Dramatically) Do you?
K: I don’t know about that, but if you do feel free to message me, I charge fifty cents a minute and I’ll read you whatever you want.
E: Are you selling yourself on the internet? K: Is that illegal?
K: Well then, yes!
E: That’s a great business plan!
K: I don’t actually do that, but I would.
E: Can we tell everyone a secret about things you used to do? K: Oh they don’t know?
E: Have we ever, have we ever told them?
K: Let’s find out. You wanna let everyone know?
E: Speaking of things that Kyle does with his voice, he used to read Fifty Shades of Grey
K: Excuse me, not just Fifty Shades of Gray, there was other smut too. Not only was it other smut, it was viewer requested smut. Cause like, I don’t know this kind of crap that’s out there , right? So people would leave comments like, “Hey after you’re done with this you should read this piece of crap book”
K: Like, this was a long time ago, this was like in 2012. E: Oh my God that’s a really long time ago.
K: Yeah yeah yeah. What would happen was like sometimes I would mess up like I would mispronounce something and then re-record but then other times the writing would be so atrocious that I would burst out laughing. And one day I guess I was tired or something or I guess I just didn’t realize that I put the audio track in the video, and people went CRAZY. They were like, “Oh, my God like I laughed with you!” or “Oh my God the way you say this word is so stupid, can we please continue saying it wrong?” And then I would and it work and it was really cool and it was so much money for so little effort. It should be illegal. It should’ve been.
E: It was (laughs)
K: It kinda was. That’s why I stopped doing it.
E: So, that’s Kyle’s history with some semblance of a podcast like something or other! I’m so glad this is out in the world now.
K: The other thing, the other thing too was like all of these books were told from the perspective of a woman. So like, I didn’t change my voice. You know what I mean? I didn’t actually act, I just read the book. So like people would come and I want to say they would wait for me to read the male parts. But I used to read with a female friend. Cause I got the idea that, “Hey maybe if a real woman reads the female parts, like people would listen more!” And they liked her, but they liked it better when it was just me. So it was like really weird and creepy and just bizarre.
E: I’m not gonna lie, I’m pretty upset I didn’t know you in 2012.
K: Yeah, well. Isn’t that when we met?
E: No, uh…Wait! Oh, my God! We just weren’t really super good friends because…. K: We knew each other but we didn’t know each other
E: Yeah I knew you…I met you in 2011. I knew of you before that though K: Yeah
E: Have we ever told you guys the story of how Kyle and I met?
K: They don’t know
E: Are we sure we’ve never told this story? Okay. So we were at Summer Camp Alumni Reunion because we went to the same summer camp it was for Kids with Disabilities. But Kyle literally only went once. So I don’t know what the heck you were doing there.
K: I hated it. Because I was with my best friend and he wanted to go.
E: Right, that makes sense. So he was there and I knew who he was and he knew who I was so I saw him in the dining hall and we were like talking\
K: …(Dramatically) From across the room!
E: It was really romantic. I was like, “Uh, are you a hugger?” And he was like….
K: “Today I am!” Is what I said
E: And then we hugged!
E: Most magical moment of my life
K: And she hasn’t left me alone since
E: No I left alone for two years while I was dating somebody else
K: You didn’t leave me alone. You just didn’t talk to me as much as you do.
E: You’re right, now I fill every void with you (laughs)
K: That’s okay. Yeah that’s how Emily and I met she just sort of wedged herself into my life and just hasn’t left so if anyone’s out there listening please save me.
E: Blink twice if you need help. HAHAHA!
K: For those of you who can’t see what I’m doing, I’m blinking rapidly. What have we learned?
E: In the course of fifty episodes? K: Yes
E: I think we’ve gotten better at the art of arguing with each other. And I sincerely mean that. I think we joke around and we say that our first episode was sparked by the fact that we were bothered by an issue and we were gonna argue and talk about it anyway so why don’t we just do it in a public forum? And we’re still doing that, yes. But at the same time I’d like to think that we’ve gotten to the point where our opinions are more nuanced and more articulated and we’re not quite as stilted when we’re having conversations with each other.
K: I would say that you’re opinions are more refined! No, I would agree, I would agree. E: Hence, I’m the brains (chuckles)
K: You are! And anyone who thinks I am has not been paying attention. Because you just are, there’s no arguing. Like, that’s one thing I will not argue, and I’ll argue anything.
K: But not that. I’m like Meatloaf. “I’ll do anything, but not that.”
E: See Kyle and I really do love each other. As much as we like to burst each other’s bubbles we also think the other is/are great. What? Grammar?
K: Yeah. Sure. I don’t know…I don’t really, It’s hard to explain that right because as real as we are on this show, like we don’t put on a persona. But the people who are listening who don’t know us, you know, don’t know that, right? So to those people we’re just these two characters. But rest assured, this is real, this is not an act.
E: Especially with a topic that I’m so passionate about. Although I think that’s always been an interesting part of our dynamic, I’m so passionate about advocacy and activism and you’re like, “Uggggh Disability. Ughhh”
K: Just cause it doesn’t…I don’t….It doesn’t click with me in the way that it does for you. But o be fair, nothing does. Like I’m very, very skeptical of groups of types of people no matter what they are. I’m not saying…No really! Like I think that labels…I’m not gonna be like, “Labels are fo soup cans!” I think they have utility. But I think that label very often is used as just a label and so I try to use as few of them as possible. Because I would rather know what you believe and why you believe it than insinuate correctly or incorrectly, especially incorrectly, what you believe based on what you call yourself. So I try to avoid doing that.
E: I think that’s fair. I suppose it’s how you wield a particular label or identity that matters. Not just that you call yourself that.
K: Not that calling yourself or how your identifying is particularly you know, wrong. It’s just not something that you do.
E: It’s not particularly wrong (chuckles).
K: Well I mean, there are wrong things to identify as, but that’s not what I mean. E: Right, like a Nazi
K: Well, yeah.
E: Well yeah, if you happen to be one, stop doing that you’re terrible. But you know, at least it’s an accurate description, you know what I mean? Like, if someone calls themselves that, you know exactly what they are and you know to avoid them and not talk to them. And it’s the same thing with labels that are not nearly as bad. It’s just like, I don’t know man, I don’t know I don’t like to assume what you believe based on what you call yourself. And everyone does that when you have a label that you prescribe to yourself. So i just don’t like that.
E: Well, there’s literally no way that people can make assumptions about what we believe because we’re so upfront about it now, I think that’s what I’ve gotten from this podcast is perhaps a little bit more firm in my perspectives about certain things.
K: Yeah, I used to say that I don’t identify as disabled for the show, and now I just don’t at all. It certainly has confirmed beliefs I thought I had. Has any of your beliefs like actually changed? Not necessarily like a complete 180 but just any change at all?
E: I think if anything, my convictions have been strengthened for the most part but, yeah I wouldn’t say that anything has changed per se, but I have had times where people have reached out and it’s really given me pause. Because maybe there was a perspective about something that I wasn’t thinking about, or maybe we said something and didn’t consider how it would be perceived. And whether or not that you agree with the feedback that you get, I still think it’s important to take feedback into account because it makes you more conscious of how your communicating and how you’re conveying what it is that you believe and what you wanna say. I will say that in spite of feeling a little bit bolder and more open about viewpoints, there’s still some things that I’m hesitant to say on the podcast and I’ve found that that’s because I worry about what people will think of my viewpoints or how they’ll perceive me. And at the same time I suppose it’s like, who am I to worry that somebody thinks a certain way of me or something? I don’t know, I can’t quite explain what I mean. Speaking of articulating myself I guess I’m not doing the best job here.
K: Well that’s okay because I’ll let you guys in on a little secret. When Emily has like a really controversial viewpoint, what she’ll do is right before we record she’ll tell me to say it, that way all the hate gets directed towards me.
E (laughs) I do not!
K: I’m also the show’s lightning rod…No. She doesn’t. But you know, she could! I would do that, E: Oh you would throw yourself under the bud for me? Thank you!
K: Of course! What kind of podcast partner would I be if wasn’t able….
K: No and in terms of feedback like we are always appreciative of it. You know, always welcome and we don’t get a lot of it but when we do it’s always thoughtful. I don’t think we’ve ever gotten a useless piece of feedback.
E: This is actually making me think of something. I wanna know who the heck listens to us. Sometimes we get people who comment, or people who email or Tweet at us and we’ve had a fair number of people now tell us when they listen to us they basically try to have a conversation back at us or talk at us or at the podcast. Who are you?
K: Yeah, yup.
E: Show yourselves!
K: Yeah we wanna know you! Come forth!
E: That’s the tough thing about podcasting is that there are only so many tools for the statistics and of course, not like we’re sitting here trying to violate your privacy. You know, we can’t really find out information about who’s listening in any in depth way. But it just would be nice to know what keeps people coming back. And clearly people do otherwise our listening numbers wouldn’t go up. But I always wonder why. I mean, are they hate listening to us? Do they hate you? Or do they hate me? Or do they actually really like us?
K: I will say that whatever reason you have to listen whether it’s love or hate, thanks. Genuinely, thank you. Like it’s no skin off our noses. But yeah I always wonder that myself like, who’s hearing us? (chuckles). It’s so weird, it’s like the weirdest thing because you and I are just sitting here and having fun and doing a show about something we care about, today. But somebody is listening and really, really taking our word for it and really taking our words to heart and really internalizing what we’re saying and that’s like… that’s a responsibility man, that’s like really surreal. And if I could say the word “real” again in that sentence.
E: Maybe if you could say the word “like” again in that sentence (laughs).
K: Did you know that filler like, “Like”… like, like… is used significantly more by men than
women but everyone thinks that women use it more.
E: Fun fact from our resident linguist. Like, actually. Oh, I just used the word, “like.”
K; No but, that wasn’t a filler “like,” that was a “like,” like a real one.
E: That’s true.
E: Kyle has a degree in linguistics and anthropology. He is smart.
K: I’m not that smart
E: No, he is. He’s modest.
K: I am modest
E: Would you say you’re humble?
E: Stay humble
K: Oh I hate that! Not that I’m not a humble person but if you have to say you’re humble, you’re not. In the same way that if you have to say you’re nice, you’re not.
E: Ha! I have to give a speech for something and Kyle’s just kinda helping me out with it and he said that if I called myself humble he would disown me! (chuckles)
K: Yup, and I will. It’s like, “Look I’m the center of attention but you know it’s fine and it’s no big deal except it actually is and that’s why you’re all here, but I’m just gonna pretend it’s not, cause reasons.”
K: It’s like “No…”
E: Going back to whatever got us on this tangent though I think the other reason why i wanna know who listens to us is that some people come to us and say that we make them feel a little bit less alone. That is so important!
E: And My God, speaking of being humble.I don’t want to toot our horns here, I really don’t. But the only reason why I think this is so important. Kyle is making a horn honking motion. The only reason that I think talking about feeling less alone is so important is I would have liked to have an Emily and Kyle when I was growing up. I say this like we’re so old, we’re both 26, but even so, people who are younger than us in high school or college have reached out to us and I realized that that was the time when I was really grappling with coming into my own. And whether you call yourself Disabled as an identity or not, the reality is that Disability is a part of a person and is something you have to grapple with and I would’ve like to hear two people sounding relatively self assured who were gonna tell me that it’s all gonna be okay.
K: I never ever got that in the way that you’re describing but having said that, I completely agree with you. I think the reason that I never got to the point that you’re describing is because I grew up and went to school around people with disabilities so it was weirder to me being able-bodied so even though I and everyone else around me knew that we were the different ones.
K: So I never really…But I completely understand that because every other person with a disability that I’ve ever met says that so it can’t be not true. But even so, I don’t know many people with CP like me. I know a few, like I collect them pretty much but like,
K: No, it’s true I generally try to keep in touch with most of them…I mean, assuming I like them. If they’re annoying well…But like, it would’ve been cool to know somebody like me and somebody like you when I was growing up too, for sure. Absolutely. And so if we could be that for anyone of you like it’s just swell, truly. Like it’s just…That’s my favorite kind of comment, it is. Like I love, I genuinely love critiques like, “Hey did you consider this, I disagree with you here, there..” Whatever. That’s a dialogue. LIke when somebody says, “Hey, thanks!” You’re welcome. You know? I don’t know.
E: Happy to serve. (Chuckles)
K: It just makes me smile
E: Of course! So I have a question for you
E: What is your favorite episode that we’ve done? K: “Day Without a Woman!”
E: Okay, hold your horses! (laughs)
E: Because there have been times where we’ve wrapped up and been like, “Oh my God this is our new favorite episode!” But explain to the good people at home why “Day Without a Woman” was your favorite.
K: First I just wanna say that the reason that we say that every episode is our new favorite I think is because we know when to not out one out. Like this is the second time we’re doing this one. And we have done an episode up to four times and we have not released that one because it kept being lost. It was the one when you’re talking about when your disability kinda sucks. It’s a very needed thing, we should redo it one of these days but it pissed us off so much at the time it was like, “Never again!” Yeah so when we say every episode is our favorite episode it’s because we’ve made some horrible ones and we don’t put out things that we just mutually don’t love. And we have full veto power. So if one of us uses it, it’s like, “Yup done, don’t even care!” But the reason “Day Without a Woman” is my favorite is specifically because we didn’t talk about disability. I mean we talked about in how the connect and interact and intersect and what have you, but it was about the day itself and just the whole process bhind it because we got it out of International Women’s Day and we did our homework and just everything about that was just…We were in such a flow state. Like it was recorded, edited, te captions and the transcript was made, the freakin’…The transcript was just made, that’s not true. The image was made. Everything was just done and done and done. Except the transcript, which was made like last week but forget I said that part.
E: Yeah we do our best to keep up with transcripts but transcripts cost money. K: Yeah, but we’re getting there.
E: So my favorite episode I would say is perhaps the one on bodily autonomy but I’m not entirely sure. I really don’t feel like I’m married to any one episode. I really like some of the more heavy episodes that we’ve done, including the one on sexual assault and harassment and I really liked that one in particular even though it was difficult for both of us to record because it wasn’t a conversation that we were seeing a lot of at the time. Not to say that we were pioneers over here originating the conversation, around DIsability and Sexual Assault, but especially in the podcasting space, that wasn’t really something that was there and it’s still something that’s largely absent but obviously being talked about more with Me Too and Times Up. becoming so
ingrained in the mainstream. But it just goes to show that there are so many issues connected to Disability that affect us on a daily basis that other people just don’t think about until they’re forced to think about it.
K: You know what? You just made me realize a little bit of something. And that is that doing the show has made me I don’t want to say braver but I think braver is the word. Because you know, we both shared some heavy stuff in that episode in particular and I remember being really hesitant about putting that out because I didn’t like what I said. Not that I said anything wrong, I just shared a bit too much, and listening back to it now, I shared compared to you, nothing at all. But i said what I said and it was a heavy thing without any details and that was a heavy thing for me because I would’ve never, ever said that under any circumstances, to anyone, much less in public. So just a little side note. But this show has definitely made me less….Like my guard is down when I’m podcasting to the internet and shouting into the void. But I think that yeah, that episode was cool. Not the subject matter, but it was necessary.
E: At the risk of sounding mildly full of ourselves, I think that a lot of what we talk about is necessary. I’m not saying that it’s necessary for people to have our opinions on the subject, just that it’s necessary to be having these kinds of conversations.
K: I would rather be disagreed with. Because if you agreed with me, then we’re both already on the same terms, but if you disagree then we both might learn something. And that’s how I feel about everything but especially in a forum like this where you know it’s me and you offering ourselves and shipping it out to the internet where every single thing anyone does at all is criticized.
E: You’ve somehow made us sound like a religious, holy experience and an Amazon Prime delivery in one sentence (chuckles)
K: That is exactly what we are. In fact, that’s our tagline forever. It used to just be “With Kyle and Emily” Now, it’s whatever she just said. I don’t remember it.
K: But I will listen to this back and I will…no I won’t.
E: So here we are at fifty-one episodes.
K: Fifty! Fifty!
E: I’m still calling this Episode 50, in my heart it’s Episode 50.
K: It is Episode 50. I specifically didn’t number the Bonus one so we would have a fiftieth episode and this is it.
E: If you numbered the Bonus one it just would’ve been another episode…
K: But I didn’t!
K: Because it was out of our schedule at the time. It was back when we had a schedule. E: We were a little fired up
K: We were ready to go.
E: Fired up! Ready to go!
K: Ready to go! Thanks Obama
E: Seriously if you don’t get that Obama reference, just stop listening to us and go Google the “Fired Up, Ready to Go Speech” please.
K: It’s a really good speech. (Sighs)
E: Okay. What is your Final Takeaway fifty-one episodes later.
K: Uh, maybe we should change the format of how we do the episodes
E: You mean like how we title them?
K: No I meant like the structure in the episode itself. Um..make every episode our fiftieth episode!
E: Sounds inspiring.
K: I think my final takeaway is this is something that frankly, started as a joke, and we took it seriously and I am glad we did. Because if we go too long without doing it, I break out into a rash and it’s part of our routine and as long as Emily and I are annoyed at something which is like 98% of the time, I mean…
E: I don’t know about your rash situation, you should really get that checked out.
K: I was joking but…Yeah what’s yours? What’s your final takeaway? Fifty episodes later!
E: Fifty one! K: Fifty!
E: My final takeaway is that it’s important to put yourself out there. It’s important to be open, it’s important to have conversations, it’s important to talk about the hard things. And by shying away from doing that, it’s a disservice to yourself and to other people. Bing open and honest is the best thing we can do for ourselves and for other people.
K: I 100% agree! I will say one more thing, just one. And that is, I like a little bit…It’s interesting to see how this Podcast has affected our real life relationship in that we specifically won’t talk about something that we both want to talk about if even one of us thinks it would make a good Podcast episode. That has happened many times. Like, many, many, many times.
E: Oh yeah because we want to have an authentic conversation and not just try to repeat what we said earlier in the day.
K: Yeah. But other than that, I think that about wraps it up unless you’ve got anything else. E: That’s it from me
E: Thank you so much for listening, whether you’ve been here since episode one, whether you’re just listening now, whether you’re binging all our episodes, whether you came in somewhere in the middle, whether you listen occasionally. We love ya.
K: 100% agree. If you have been here since episode one please email us! Please, don’t be shy I wanna know. We wanna know.
E: Yeah, we totally do!
K: Anyway, goodnight everybody thanks for listening please don’t stop, we need you! E: Bye!